Cleaning up

[sid]

Remember Dreamverse? And Bjorn? I've never posted that story other than as chapters, but I have a file now that's almost ready to be posted.

But I've found a couple of errors I want to clean up:

At one point I used 'beg the question' incorrectly:

Jack’s heart clenched. He leaned back in his chair. “Is this conversation over yet?”

“Daniel… but you did not want to talk about Daniel.”

“Please,” Jack said through tight lips.

“I thought you should know these things.”

And didn’t that just beg the question of what Daniel had told Bjorn.

I want to replace the incorrect usage, but I still want to keep the bitter flavor of the original sentence. Somehow, 'didn't that just raise the question...' doesn't seem to work. Does anyone have a suggestion to re-work that sentence and still hang onto Jack's anger?


In a later section, I have Teal'c announcing his need to kel'no'reem. BUT, this is after Daniel descends, so Teal'c is on tretonin and doesn't need to kel'no'reem anymore. Does anyone recall canon references to kel'no'reem post-Season Six? Maybe he desires to kel'no'reem? It's really just an excuse to get Sam and Teal'c out of Jack's house, because PLOT...so he could just decide it's bedtime, it's getting late, he's tired, whatever. Thoughts?

Comments

[gategremlyn]

flaunt the question?

Teal'c says "I am unable to kel-no-reem as I once did since I began using tretonin" in 7.01 Fallen. He's sitting surrounded by candles and Daniel comes in. I don't know if he mentions anything like that before that episode. He loses the symbiote in Changeling (6.19), right?

[sid]

And on the LJ side I've been supplied with a quote where Teal'c says kel'no'reem makes him feel better, even though he doesn't need to do it any more. So he hasn't given it up. Hmm. Thank you!

Yes, in Changeling, or maybe the ep after. I obviously failed to take that into account when I was writing the story.

Flaunt doesn't sound quite right, but it does suggest some other avenues to me. Thanks again!

[green_grrl]

Dreamverse!

Maybe: Jack suddenly wasn't sure he wanted the question of what Daniel had told Bjorn answered.

Teal'c can be doing an early-morning training with the Marines and have to go.

[sid]

Dreeeeeamverse! :-D

Ooh, thank you for those suggestions! These questions have been pending since before I went to Calgary, I think, and my brain has remained silent. Silly brain!

[princessofgeeks]

I guess I 'm an idiot but I thought beg the question was ok?

and t definitely went through the motions of kel no reem even after he went on tretonin. this is canon. it must have been more like straight up meditataion.

hi!

[sid]

Hi! *looks up 'beg the question' again* I can never remember the true meaning of the phrase. This explains it: http://begthequestion.info/

(And after following a link or two at that site, I see "prompts the question" as a suggested alternative. That might work for me!)

[ivorygates]

Does this help at all?

http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/beg+the+question

[sid]

It helps me spot the incorrect, but widely accepted, usages of the phrase! But it doesn't offer me any alternative ways to say what I really mean.

I found "prompt the question" at another site I was looking at. I'm pondering that one...

[ivorygates]

Hm.

[annejack]

Hmmm, I don't know why 'beg the question' is used incorrectly? It sounds good there to me.

But maybe : And doesn't that make you wonder what exactly Daniel had told Bjorn? Or; And, friends and neighbors, what exactly had Daniel told Bjorn?

I think Teal'c still did kel'no'reem as a mere meditation even when the symbiote was gone,though I don't have any canon reference at hand about that right now, sorry.

[sid]

Other folks have said the same about Teal'c, so it must be canon!

'Beg the question' originally has a specific meaning as a logical fallacy: http://begthequestion.info/

It sounds good there because it's widely used that way these days. But grammar stickler Jack would probably know better, so I want to rephrase the sentence. Sticking in a 'friends and neighbors', or something along those lines, would definitely help keep the sarcastic, bitter edge I want to retain! Thank you for the suggestions! :-)

[annejack]

Oh, thanks for the link, Sid! I had no idea about that. Learn something new every day :)

[ivorygates]

How about: And didn't that just open a great big can of worms?

[sid]

That is exactly the tone I am looking for! I might be able to use that somehow...

Thank you!

[ivorygates]

Yay! Glad I thought of something: it was starting to bug me too, and it isn't even my story.... :P

[sid]

;-P

[ivorygates]

*serene*

[sg-wonderland.livejournal.com]

In answer to the second question, in Season Seven's 'Orpheus', Teal'c tells Daniel:

TEAL'C
Kel'no'reem is unnecessary. Although it does make me feel—better. Colonel O'Neill has officially informed me that—I have my 'mojo' back.

[sid]

Thank you! I was nearly certain there had been a reference. :-)

[lolmac]

I'm not entirely clear on what the 'beg the question' sentence is actually saying, or trying to say. Can you expand a bit? I think I have a couple of ideas, but I need a clearer sense of your intention before I offer any suggestions.

[sid]

Okay. Jack is meeting Bjorn for the first time. He first became aware of Bjorn when he (Jack) made a move on Daniel, only to find out Daniel was already seeing someone else. Now Bjorn is telling Jack how much he (Bjorn) cares for Daniel, how he sees the future going for the two of them...and he's saying he thinks Jack needs to know these things.

So Jack is wondering, not for the first time, just what Daniel may have told Bjorn about what Jack feels for Daniel. Because Bjorn seems to be acting as though he knows Jack is also in love with Daniel.

(Wow, it's hard to write about an all-male triangle!)

[lolmac]

“Please,” Jack said through tight lips.

“I thought you should know these things.”

And didn’t that just rip open the question of what Daniel had told Bjorn.

FWIW -- I was mentally playing around with the image of opening the question, and looking for harsh ways to describe it. I had tried 'raising' the question, but that led to innuendo that wasn/t at all what was wanted!

[sid]

Rip is good! Ivorygates just suggested 'opening a big ol' can of worms' (I'm paraphrasing.) Some combination of that and this could work...

I'm getting lots of words and images to play with. Something's going to fall into place! Thank you! :-)